Saxophone Forum


by tmgaus51
(16 posts)
18 years ago

jazz phrasing

My sax teacher says that in my jazz articulation, I swing "too hard" giving the eighth notes a dotted eighth-sixteenth feel instead of the triplet feel they should have. Also, I apparently tongue too hard, closing off the reed, and giving the phrase a hokey feel instead of smooth which also messes up the swing feel. Are there any exercises I should do to even out my swing and lighten up my tonguing? Thanks in advance, Dave

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  1. by CountSpatula
    (602 posts)

    18 years ago

    Re: jazz phrasing

    Try listening to jazz artists and you could even play along with some of them.

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  2. by jamterry
    (573 posts)

    18 years ago

    Re: jazz phrasing

    Test

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    1. by jamterry
      (573 posts)

      18 years ago

      Re: jazz phrasing

      Hi Dave, I'm having trouble posting, so bear with me. :D It sounds to me like you are concentrating so much on getting around, that your phrasing is suffering. You have to get that stuff so it's easy for you to play, which gives you time for phrasing. Then your swing will even out. I can only tell you what works for me. After I learn a part, I practice it at a clip at which I can barely hang on. After that, I take a break and come back to it at normal speed. It will get easier to get around, which gives your mind and fingers space for phrasing. The biggest problem with triplets is rushing. I have a solo with eight triplets in a row that go into two whole notes. I have to really watch myself as not to rush to the and. On a fast song, I'm looking outside the song at those triplets, and I see those little three note brackets that I have to split dead even. All this is going on in split seconds, which is why you have to be able get around with ease. On a slow tune, I see a kid on a swing and the upward and downward arc. Even and graceful up and down. On the tonguing, again getting around. When you get it faster than you need it, you're mind and tongue will have some space for articulation. As far as exercise book, I like Marcel Mule's Gammes Et Arpeggios, which are scales and arpeggios. lots of good stuff in there including triplets. Your tongue and fingers come with time and practice. Good luck on that Dave :) Terry

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  3. by landrusax
    (44 posts)

    18 years ago

    Re: jazz phrasing

    Hello Dave, If you don't have any Lester Young records you should go out and buy some. I recommend "The Lester Young Story" it is a four CD box set on Proper records. It is about $35 and is a great collection. Lester Young had an incredible swing feel, I know the more I listen to the greats like Lester the more you will know when you are swinging or not. I think it is a great tool to record yourself playing a passage that you are working on and listen back to yourself to hear what you think you need to work on. I try to listen to my practice session and/or conerts to critique what I don't realize I am doing at the time. If you hear yourself you will understand what your teacher is trying to tell you. About tonguing, I had a clarinet teacher that had me blow through the sax without tonguing a note (open C# is a good note to try this on). Then he had me use my tongue to stop the reed, while still letting the air go through the horn. In other words, you are blowing like you normally do, but you have your tongue on the reed just enough to stop it from moving. This will let you know exactly how soft you can tongue the reed. You don't need to shut off the opening of the mouthpiece, just stop the reed from vibrating. This helped me a lot in understanding how to tongue. Also, use the sylable " Di " (like you say Disney) to hit the reed from below instead of head on. Practice major scales while thinking " Di Di Di " as lightly as you can. I hope this helps, Good luck, B

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    1. by landrusax
      (44 posts)

      18 years ago

      Re: jazz phrasing

      I dont know what happened to my quotations, but it was supposed to say " Di " and "Di Di Di"

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  4. by jamterry
    (573 posts)

    18 years ago

    Re: jazz phrasing

    Hey Dave, I forgot to tell you something regarding tonguing. I like to play the old surf song wipe out to work my tongue out. Take any note or sequence you want and play the drum part with your tongue. You have to hit it nice and light with the double tonguing technique. I use both T and D sounds. Besides that it's fun :) Terry

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    1. by saxplaya81
      (110 posts)

      18 years ago

      Re: jazz phrasing

      Part of the reason your tonguing sounds so hard is because you may be touching the reed closer to the back of your tongue, the proper way is touch the tip of your tongue to the tip of the mouthpiece, so concentrate on that, when i was younger, to practice tonguing i would just take the mouthpeice and reed and blow are through it (not making a sound) and practice different articulations concentrating on tip to tip. A good book to help your technique is Basic Technique for Saxophone by Jack Snavely

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      1. by saxplaya81
        (110 posts)

        18 years ago

        Re: jazz phrasing

        im sorry i actually meant to say tip of the tongue to the tip of the reed.

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        1. by knorter
          (205 posts)

          18 years ago

          Re: jazz phrasing

          Dave, I'm going to try to send you a handout that I use for clinics. It's a pdf file that I'll attach to an email. Good luck-let me know if it helps. Kristy

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        2. by tmgaus51
          (16 posts)

          18 years ago

          Re: jazz phrasing

          Thanks for your responses everyone. I definitely have a lot of work in front of me. Kristy, for some reason the e-mail didn't go through. Maybe try this one: [email protected]. Thanks again.

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